The ears make me tink it's a tiger cub, but no stripes, hmm...
Can't wait to see it finished though, g'luck on the water, because water is kinda of hard to draw, especially since you seem to be making it a clear spring and reflective.
Whee, halftones rock, I'll stop now, because three comments per version per user is quite enough. Please finish as soon as possible ^_^
(And you can put horns if you like, it's your picture, I just meant I really couldn't imagine them looking appropriate for this piece, but for all I know you might be able to pull it off)
i'm sure i'm not the only one who noticed this, but she looks like she's having more fun than she should when doing that... erm, horns would look cool, but dont make them big. i cant wait to see how u do tha water, cuz i really dont understand how ppl draw/colour water.... i just get confused ><
The fact that people keep ripping off my character designs is pissing me off to the point of no return. >>.<<
And the fact that people keep copying Khyle hurts even more, because he's been stolen once already. >>.<< Doesn't anyone care about original characters anymore??? >>.<< RARGH.
EXCUSE ME ALINNIA... but... I HIGHLY DOUBT THAT TORANEKO WAS COPYING YOU OR THAT OTHER PERSON!! SO, BACK OFF!! :) There. How dare someone say something like that about you! You're not a thieve. BTW, nice picture! ^_^
*pokes Pinku*
While I'm sure that it was not the intention, it's just one too many similarities. I know while this would mean every tan/gold/horned/stripped/feline-close-to-human would be at risk... yet I don't see those pop up very often. Especially the kind with two facial stripes, dark colored fingers, and the fact that the horns were going to be left out but added in is just all a teeny bit suspicious.
Not saying ToraNeko is a thief... but perhaps inspired?
LMFAO buwhahahahahaha its a fucking furrie (no offence theyre is tons of skill involved with the shading and halftones) But C'mon you saying , Aninnia, that your the first ever to say "hey, what if i mix animal cualities with human ones!" man thats just childish....lol
*siiiigh* >e.e< What would you like to see first? http://www.deviantart.com/view/5190587/ http://www.deviantart.com/view/4032941/ http://www.deviantart.com/view/2962325/
....?
And I have more where that came from.
Each one are dated. Khyle is also a legally copyrighted character. He is post-dated and unopened, as one may say... I'm quite serious about my character designs. What ToraNeko has 'come up' with... is much, much too suspcious. See for yourself.
I even posted a pic of him on here: http://www.cellosoft.com/2draw/view/15328/
I /know/ ToraNeko has seen my work. She's commented on my things. I've commented on her things. So view for yourself.
so if i draw a furry with horns you'll get mad at me too? even if its the oposite sex as the one you keep drawing like this one just happens to be? u do see, people everywhere come up with the idea of a furry that happens to have horns and striped, also do u feel like sewing square soft for using your idea in almost all there games? specially ff9 with all them animal ppl, i'm more than certain that a few of them follow close to the same artistic criteria as your own.
No, if you draw a furry with horns I wouldn't get mad at you. That's just silly.
The thing is... there are a thousand /different/ ways you can draw a furry that has horns and that is striped. You could draw them with squiggly stripes, or neon patterns, or make them black and white or blue and green or red.... As a long-time anthro artist in the past, I /know/ that a lot of furries look alike. The trick is to do things as differently as possible.
In this case... I find it /incredibly/ suspicious that the color combination she's used is the exact same. It has darkened fingers. The stripes on the face are of the same color combination/length.
I don't care if people are... 'inspired'... I only care when people don't take the time and energy to come up with something totally their own... and only change small, accessorable things, such as the hair/eye color/nose color, etc.
The other thing that makes me incredibly suspicious is the fact that the horns were her 'original' idea... quote-unquote... she didn't put them in... but then put them in, deciding to make them smaller. Hey. It's all written up there...
I mean... why didn't ToraNeko make it black? or give it moon-shaped markings instead of stripes? Or made it all one color? Or something like that? ... Why did she pick /those/ perticular colors? Right?
(And thank you for your comment. I appreciate it :3)
the colour combination happens to be very close to that of a cougar, or most other naturally coloured animals. cougartigerleopard are just a few animals that follow that colour detail. though yes they do have black stripes if you look at the different colours of brown on them it looks very close to that of ToraNeko's pic.
I am not totally disclosing the idea that she was inspired by your art, and if she was i do see enough difference here for it to not even be classified as fan art, paid in you hommage (i'm sure i spelt that wrong).
I am sorry, but I do not see any connection at all between this picture and those 4 links you gave.
Besides the fact this one is obviously female, and yours is male, the structure of the face, eyes, mouth, ears, nose, hair, and horns are all completely different. In fact, it's arguable that there are easily twice as many differences as similarities. The similarities (OK, a furry, never seen those. Devil horns? Who would have thought of such a thing? Dark fingers, eh? Just don't sue siamese cats. And the shocker, a feline with stripes. That is definitely out of a fairy tale.) are so generic, it's hardly worth fretting over.
If she actually wanted to "rip off" your character, she did a really bad job of it.
Oh, I know that. Like, where the colors /come/ from. And cougar and tiger and leopard colors are all fine and well and good, but it's just the matter of how she's placed them in the image, is what I mean by color combination.
Khyle has those colors and markings for reasons. He's a combination of 2 (and only 2) specific 'demons' ... how we would view them as animals would simply be that he's one part Tiger (with horns), and he's one part Suricate/Meerkat. Since meerkats are most usually potrayed with darkened fingers, this is why he has the darkened fingers. He has the stripes, because he's part tiger, and he has horns because this perticular race of tiger-demons have horns. His color combination (of how I placed the colors down) is that of a suricate, specifically. The darkened fingers is what took the cake for me, and the addage of horns afterward just sealed the deal.
There /is/ a difference, yes. But they're only changes in accessorised features, such as eyes and hair and such...I'm talking about the overall, very basic character design here.
Sure she could say it's fan art and everything... and I mean, people only hafta /ask/ me if they wanna USE stuff... I HATE finding out that people've been using stuff /without/ permission, and they're sneaky about it. Nevertheless, I still don't like to see people using similar character designs to things. I really think it shows a flaw in the person's personal creativity, myself. She would only have to do a few very simple things to make this character her own, even with the colors that she's using. Just use them in a different way... like, move the stripes to the forehead... get rid of the brown markings on the fingers... or only mark the fingers halfway... or have it come right into the hand... just something to make it /her own/...
I don't want anything to happen to the peice... it's a very well drawn picture... I'm just concerned for my character design's well-being, that's all... as it's happened before...
Edit: I'm not trying to turn 2draw into a cat fight >>.<< It's just that I feel that the designs are much too similar, and much too suspicious for comfort. I have a right to be able to post my work and not come across something that was 'inspired' by my stuff, without anyone telling me about it. There's a lot of that sort of stuff going on, and it really discourages artists from wanting to post things, or to support anything on the internet that has to do with the arts.
Second off, you did not read what I wrote. The faces are completely different. And if you ask me, that is extremely significant in something that's remotely human. Look at the two characters side-by-side, toraneko's character's face is round and plump. Yours is very tall, thin, and lean. Toraneko's character's nose is almost flat against the face, yours is quite obviously sticking out considerably and is an important feature of your character, as far as expression. The eyebrows on your character are nearly on the eyes themselves, whereas the eyesbrows on toraneko's character are almost halfway between the hairline and her hairs. Your character has a much bigger and longer chin.
And that's just the face. The hair is completely different (and designing hair is not an easy task. That is to say, you cannot consider it as "changing an accessory"). The ears are slightly similar, but yours are quite distinctly pointed, while these are round (as far as the ear that is exposed is concerned). Toraneko's also has furry ears (as in hair coming out of ears and whatnot), while yours are fairly smooth.
Other things? The horns come out of a completely different place. and look nothing like the horns you drew. Toraneko's horns seem more like little devil horns while yours seem like ram's horns. Claws are considerably different, and the contrast on the fingers here is considerably different from yours. Sure, both characters have different colored fingers, but as I mentioned above, siamese cats have black paws... These in fact are much more similar to a siamese cat's than yours, as they are black, while yours are just a slightly darker brown than the rest of the hand.
Did I mention the fact that they are opposite sex!?
I shall rest my case now. I think you should be less uptight about your drawings unless the resemblance is undeniable. Too much stress will just come out in your drawings... the whole purpose for making art is so that other people can enjoy it. If you do not show anyone your work, what is the point?
I agree, it is annoying if someone outright copies and steals your ideas, but this is a little extreme. If you tried to sue for copyright infringement, you would most likely find yourself laughed out of the courtroom.
Now, as far as fanart is concerned, I do not see any reason one should have permission to draw fanart of your character or design, provided that they mention that it is fanart. You really cannot stop someone from liking your character design and trying to recreate it, provided that they say they are. It basically comes down to whether or not you are losing money due to an infringement.
You're working off the assumption that she -was- inspired from your work. This doesn't hav eto be true.
If you can think it up on your own (which I have no proof of, but I'll accept it for now) Why can't she?
There is nothing new under the Sun, Alinnia.
Marcello: First off, I'm not going to use italics strait out if I don't want to. Everyone has their own perticular internet-writing style. I use mine. You use yours.
I didn't get to read what you wrote, because I was /still/ writing mine after you posted. I'm not a mind reader. And I cannot see into the future.
Character design is a specific art, and it's one of my majors in my post-secondary education. I've taken many classes, many lessons, many crash-courses on the subject, and I /know/ what motivates people to put certain things into their designs. I /know/ what makes them similar. I /know/ what makes them different. I'm not stupid. I can see that it is female. I can see the difference in bone structure and what have you. But I'm not talking about sex or bone structure or the shape of their hair. I'm talking about the overall /design/. The DESIGN of the character. What kind of creature the OVERALL LOOK is potraying. That's what character DESIGN is. The DESIGN is much too suspiciously similar.
I don't have to post my work. I don't /have/ to share it with people. I can keep it to myself, and most of the time I prefer to. If anything, I create most, if not all, of my art to be enjoyed by myself. 2draw, DA, or any other of those artist sites are NOT a neccesity.
And it's hard not to get stressed about things when you know the person has seen your work... and they know what your work looks like. It's happened to me more than once where people've been 'inspired'... and most of the time I'm not even the one who finds these peices first.
And this issue isn't about money. It's about the love I have for my characters. They're my creations. My 'babies'. They have stories, lives, families, and histories. Seeing the look of your character being 'reproduced' in a random image breaks the heart, because of all the work that went into creating them.
Harmanye: Hey, I'm not saying she can't think up her own stuff. It's just that I know she's seen my work (as she's commented on it) and the designs are very similar. You /can/ think up new stuff. It just takes effort.
You are reading way too much into the picture. I'm not calling you stupid, although it seems to be the other way around. If you want to speak all abstractly and "superiorly," this character seems very happy, innocent and self-content, while yours seems a lot more adolecent and sophmoric with a possibly shadowed past.
Maybe they are more similar than I think, but from the 4 pictures you linked, I will have to say the only real similarity is that they're both furries.
I'm not trying to act 'superior' about anything... I'm just telling what I know. It's come to a point where artists who /do/ come up with original stuff have to be so incredibly careful and observant of what other people are doing.. because they know if they don't protect what means a lot to them, it's going to be picked up and used by someone else (regardless of what they do), and they won't have their original creations to have and hold anymore, even though they want to share their ideas with the world.
All I'm wanting to put forward through it is the fact that it is challenging to come up with something truely, truely original, but once you manage to do it, you're going to want to try and keep as much of it yours as you can. Like I said before, if she wanted to truely make it hers, to the point where it could be a /very/ original character, but still KEEP the stripes, and the markings, and the horns, she'd just hafta change a few things... But then she should keep an eye on other peoples' work to make /sure/ her designs are original, and are kept hers. It's simple, really. Challenging, but simple.
But dude, they don't look the same. Not even a little. You're freaking nuts. Shut up you annoy me.
Nice drawing ToraNeko, I love the shines on the hair especially, and the water coming off the tongue. She be thirsty! lol. I hope you finish it despite everything. ^_^
*edit*I apologize, that was harsh, but all that bickering bugged meh.
Ummm, Okay, lets see what happenend while I was gone @.@
Alright, so I'll say now, I want to thank everyone out there for defending me, and also, I can see exactly where Alinnia's perdicement is. Although I can see What you are complaining about, none of you pictures were in my mind, or intended when I did this. I was looking for new ears types that I don't usally do, as I had been playing around with cat and rabbit ears. I was driving, and pasted by the cow farm almost right across the street (Great cheese comes from happy cows, happy cows come from California) and was like "Ooo! Havn't ried that yet!" So playing around with them, I though they were more goat ears. Ta da, ears. And the earings are just there because they were kinda bland without. I had no plan of doing the coloring like yours, and if I did, I am truly sorry, quite frankly (maybe due to my memory flaws) all I can recall of yours was a white one. I used that particullar color because I usally use light skin tones, so I wanted it to be a skin tone, but not really, So the color I chose on was a slightly yellower color of my skin. And the white patch arounfd the mouth? I have a cat? What can I say? The hands I did that way becuse it was like hooves, but I didn't really want hooves, so I apted for that. Horns? Little cute ones, but again, playing on the cow/goat theme. The hair, That was hard, but entirly out of my hear with extreeme toying with. And yes, as Macello said, the original plan was a girl, its not my doing if some thought it was a boy. Oh and yes, the strips? If you read the posts at the top, Harmenye talked about strips. Thats the way I do all my strips. And besides, that has to be the most BASIC Way to draw them. How could THAT be infringing upon your rights? So again, I am greatly sorry for any trouble this caused, and I can see why there is such a fuss, but really, this is somewhat, dare I say, childish?
Edit: Umm, I don't go on Devin Art at all... It doesn't seem to like my connection, so I can't see most of the pictures, including the ones you sent links too. So how can I copy what I can't see? And further more, I find this quite offencive in a few of your remarks. For one, you say you arn't a mind reader, but the way you flash around all the courses you've taken, it seems very much so that you want to imply that you understand fully character buliding. That you can look at anything and quite simply figure out how and why it was created. So I suppose you no longer can have chance occurances, everything was already pre-planed, hm? And you also seem quite certain that I have no capabilities of thinking up my own work, that I just copy. What kinda---, pardon, is that? I should search the whole internet, and go around the world before drawing anything, just to make sure that no one has the same Idea. Come on, the whole world is built on modifying diffrent things, one thing leading to another. I'm sure that if you think about it, your very thoughts trail from one thing to another, till you are on an intierly diffrent plane then from what you thought before. You also stated yourself that your character is a hybrid of 2 difrent animals, but you didn't think them up, now did you? And its really really not to hard to draw something with horns and strips, I'm sure even you arn't the first one to think about it. So if you don't mind, I fond this whole thing quite bothersome, especially after looking back, I think I only commented on ONE of your pictures, that Tiger one.
Bwahahahahah... this whole argument started to piss me off, until i read through all the replies. I didn't really go through the detailed descriptions about the character designs and all that, because in the end it doesn't matter at all. If it looks good, it looks good (and this looks good). I can see how the water would be difficult to portray in the same style that you used (kinda like colored pencils). I must say, the black lines on the water do look out of place.
You really have to admit though, whipping out those links to devart as if they would prove your point would have been nice, except for fact that the designs, as you so put it, of the characters are completely different. I just don't get what you were alluding to at all, as imo they don't look remotely similar. And I'm not just talking about the details or whatever, I'm talking about what you were refering to with the whole "overall look"... no similarities whatsoever, sorry but I just don't see any. Is this over-reaction just a sympton of overly tight sphincter muscles?
Reading all that arguing made me angry. Then I scrolled back up to see the picture and I got happy again! Such is the power of art.
I could just fall in love with this picture. Everything's there, all placed to it's right place making this a balanced masterpiece. The colours, lineart... heck, even the slight reflection on the water or how them fingers show through the water.
I like the original, felineish creature, as it reminds me of a fursona I created for my best friend. She, too, has horns and cat-like features and hooves. Even the hair-colour reminds of her. And am I bitching about copyrights? Hell no.~ Since it's said that a room with a hundred chimpanzees, given the time and typewriters, could type the whole Shakespeare productions, then why couldn't two people in this world come up with similar-looking characters? Not to say that they remind (as Marcello said) in any other real way that both are furries and have horns.
And if my comment starts the whole stupid, insensible whining all over again, I'm sorry in advance.
'Artistic Moderator' also seems to be a popular oxymoron these days, eh, Marcello?
After a wonderfully busy weekend, and a successful college art sale... I have finally found the time to make my final comment on this peice. Sure, it's a nice peice. The drawing is nice. The coloring is nice. The idea is nice. But the character design is not original... it's as simple as that. It disappoints me to see such uncreative artists... and irrisponsible moderators. It's irritating to know that the 'attitudes' of the DeviantArt Admin have migrated on to other sites that /seem/ to have so much potential...
I really don't know if these 'programmers-turned-art-board-mods' understand what they've gotten themselves into. I know of many, hardworking, original character designers, many moving into the feild of animation, like myself, who constantly have their character designs copied and stolen, and the administration of the site do /nothing/ about it. (Some administration are MUCH better than others... Tiemann of the TLKFAA is rather strict about copyright laws... and he's well-respected for that.) If /I/ didn't think I was being ripped off, I wouldn't've said anything. Anything at all. ...
(And YES, ToraNeko, as a matter of fact, before most character designers come up with a new concept, we DO search the internet quite thuroughly to see what current designs are out there, and what is at the height of pop culture in the current time, to make /sure/ our concepts are different than those around us... it's all part of our responsibility as designers... If you can't take on that responsibility... DON'T DO IT.)
And of COURSE the world is built on modifying different things. My character in and of himself must be made of at least 12 different concepts from existing characters from popular series'... but you'd never know. It IS a hybrid of 2 different animals.. animals aren't copyrighted.. however, within the thousands of combinations one /could/ have made with these animals, why should 2 designs look /that/ simliar at all? And when I say look at the image, I mean put both of them side-by-side and compare. NOT look at /one/ picture for two seconds, and then ('try to') look at the other for two seconds.. of course you're going to conclude and assume without looking.
It's sad that artists can't use the internet as a tool for their work, and not be safe. And when I say artists, I don't mean the fanboys, fangirls, and wannabes that frequent these sites. I mean the artists who know what they're doing. The serious ones who plan on doing this as a career for the rest of their lives. Not some little hobby that they do once in awhile. It's sad that those serious about their practition have to be cautious about what they do, and what they post, in fear of the concept of those who can't seem to reach beyond what they see right in front of them.
Personally, I don't think these sites should be supported anymore. No 2draw. No DeviantArt. No Elfwood. No VCL. No mass-oriented art sites at all in existance. There are too many fan-wannabes that look through them... wannabes that just don't appreciate originality for what it is. Private galleries are the way to go, and I can assure you that artists DO NOT need any of these silly sites to get exposure, or to share their art with other people. Sure, I thought it was fun in the beginning... but now it's just out of hand. Moderators are irrisponsible... most 'members' and 'critics' even moreso... equality is null.
These sites no longer have my support. No funding. No art. No reccomendations. Only warnings to those who may wish to join. Don't post your ideas on these sites.. fan-wannabes /will/ steal them..
And those who haven't had their ideas ripped-off yet? ... Watch. It'll happen. Then you'll know how /I/ feel.
Find me some people who actually agree with you, because there sure are a lot of people who do not. Copyright law is not being broken here, so do not make it sound like someone is doing you a great injustice.
edit: at the expense of my linear algebra homework, I am gonna actually try replying to your message. Although I find it hard to stop laughing.
'Artistic Moderator' also seems to be a popular oxymoron these days, eh, Marcello?
Despite what you might think, the moderators for a site are to help me, not you. No where do we claim to be artistic moderators or professionals in the field of critiquing or judging your pictures. We are not paid enough for that.
After a wonderfully busy weekend, and a successful college art sale... I have finally found the time to make my final comment on this peice.
Sorry to take you away from your busy schedule. But aside from your effort to make yourself sound superior again, you really need to learn how to spell. A college student has no excuse for misspelling 8 words in something that short, especially with words such as "piece," "irresponsible," "field," "thoroughly," and so on. And none are typos.
I really don't know if these 'programmers-turned-art-board-mods' understand what they've gotten themselves into. I know of many, hardworking, original character designers, many moving into the feild of animation, like myself, who constantly have their character designs copied and stolen, and the administration of the site do /nothing/ about it.
First off, as we do not know of every character or drawing submitted on the internet, we really cannot do anything about pieces that no one says anything about. In this case, there is no relation at all between the characters to give you any case.
(Some administration are MUCH better than others... Tiemann of the TLKFAA is rather strict about copyright laws... and he's well-respected for that.)
Then e-mail him and send him this link, and have him CC me a reply, I want to hear his opinion.
before most character designers come up with a new concept, we DO search the internet quite thuroughly to see what current designs are out there, and what is at the height of pop culture in the current time
Care to share how one goes about doing this? How would someone find your design, for example, and know to avoid copying it? Search for "original furries with horns" on google?
And when I say look at the image, I mean put both of them side-by-side and compare. NOT look at /one/ picture for two seconds, and then ('try to') look at the other for two seconds.. of course you're going to conclude and assume without looking.
Again, you continue to insult my intelligence. And though undeserving, I spent quite a bit of time looking over both of them, side-by-side to see if I could see what you meant. Alas I found quite the opposite, as I detailed in my previous messages.
It's sad that artists can't use the internet as a tool for their work, and not be safe. And when I say artists, I don't mean the fanboys, fangirls, and wannabes that frequent these sites. I mean the artists who know what they're doing. The serious ones who plan on doing this as a career for the rest of their lives. Not some little hobby that they do once in awhile. It's sad that those serious about their practition have to be cautious about what they do, and what they post, in fear of the concept of those who can't seem to reach beyond what they see right in front of them.
Quite sad. Definitely not safe, in fact, you might even get a virus! *shocker* I want to find someone serious about their "practition." (P.s. I am mocking you here, because your b.s.ing is amusing.)
Personally, I don't think these sites should be supported anymore. No 2draw. No DeviantArt. No Elfwood. No VCL. No mass-oriented art sites at all in existance. There are too many fan-wannabes that look through them... wannabes that just don't appreciate originality for what it is.
Do not support them, then. No one is forcing you.
Private galleries are the way to go, and I can assure you that artists DO NOT need any of these silly sites to get exposure, or to share their art with other people.
You realize you sound like a snob when you say that, right?
Sure, I thought it was fun in the beginning... but now it's just out of hand. Moderators are irrisponsible... most 'members' and 'critics' even moreso... equality is null.
This is your problem, you are so caught up in the politics of it that you cannot do it for fun. 2draw is not a place to post your resume, it is to have fun drawing in one's spare time.
And those who haven't had their ideas ripped-off yet? ... Watch. It'll happen.
Wow, if something this "similar" is the worst that will happen when someone rips me off, I guess I should not be too worried about anything!
Then you'll know how /I/ feel.
I shudder at the thought.
And in conclusion, your design is not that great. I mean, come on, it is a furry.
:3
Marcello... most people against furry art don't find originality in their peices... I've seen a few rants and such where furry artists feel 'unloved' as opposed to a person who copies 'anime' art
o.o *shrugs* But that's just me.. find one of those people supporting her? Well I'd be one :3
Watch as I end up on some.. hit list now or something x.x;;
.... and yis, Mr. Tiemann is very strict about such things... I doubt Alinnia will be stopping here anymore so I'll deliver him this postage and stuff, alrighties? :3
Sometimes I just wish some peeps would see eye to eye instead of thinking their views are always correct...
Although posting to the pic...
only thing I see wrong with it is the tongue... x.x Too red for my tastes.. other than that, it's a fine peice. If it was copy designed or not, I like it :3
post comment
You need to be logged in to post a comment. If you don't have an account, sign up now!
drawn in 1 hour 8 min
Can't wait to see it finished though, g'luck on the water, because water is kinda of hard to draw, especially since you seem to be making it a clear spring and reflective.
(And you can put horns if you like, it's your picture, I just meant I really couldn't imagine them looking appropriate for this piece, but for all I know you might be able to pull it off)
drawn in 1 hour 33 min
Nice job on making the fingers look underwater, and the stripes are realy nice too! ^_^
drawn in 21 min
And the fact that people keep copying Khyle hurts even more, because he's been stolen once already. >>.<< Doesn't anyone care about original characters anymore??? >>.<< RARGH.
While I'm sure that it was not the intention, it's just one too many similarities. I know while this would mean every tan/gold/horned/stripped/feline-close-to-human would be at risk... yet I don't see those pop up very often. Especially the kind with two facial stripes, dark colored fingers, and the fact that the horns were going to be left out but added in is just all a teeny bit suspicious.
Not saying ToraNeko is a thief... but perhaps inspired?
http://www.deviantart.com/view/5190587/
http://www.deviantart.com/view/4032941/
http://www.deviantart.com/view/2962325/
....?
And I have more where that came from.
Each one are dated. Khyle is also a legally copyrighted character. He is post-dated and unopened, as one may say... I'm quite serious about my character designs. What ToraNeko has 'come up' with... is much, much too suspcious. See for yourself.
I even posted a pic of him on here: http://www.cellosoft.com/2draw/view/15328/
I /know/ ToraNeko has seen my work. She's commented on my things. I've commented on her things. So view for yourself.
btw, nice artwork =)
The thing is... there are a thousand /different/ ways you can draw a furry that has horns and that is striped. You could draw them with squiggly stripes, or neon patterns, or make them black and white or blue and green or red.... As a long-time anthro artist in the past, I /know/ that a lot of furries look alike. The trick is to do things as differently as possible.
In this case... I find it /incredibly/ suspicious that the color combination she's used is the exact same. It has darkened fingers. The stripes on the face are of the same color combination/length.
I don't care if people are... 'inspired'... I only care when people don't take the time and energy to come up with something totally their own... and only change small, accessorable things, such as the hair/eye color/nose color, etc.
The other thing that makes me incredibly suspicious is the fact that the horns were her 'original' idea... quote-unquote... she didn't put them in... but then put them in, deciding to make them smaller. Hey. It's all written up there...
I mean... why didn't ToraNeko make it black? or give it moon-shaped markings instead of stripes? Or made it all one color? Or something like that? ... Why did she pick /those/ perticular colors? Right?
(And thank you for your comment. I appreciate it :3)
I am not totally disclosing the idea that she was inspired by your art, and if she was i do see enough difference here for it to not even be classified as fan art, paid in you hommage (i'm sure i spelt that wrong).
Besides the fact this one is obviously female, and yours is male, the structure of the face, eyes, mouth, ears, nose, hair, and horns are all completely different. In fact, it's arguable that there are easily twice as many differences as similarities. The similarities (OK, a furry, never seen those. Devil horns? Who would have thought of such a thing? Dark fingers, eh? Just don't sue siamese cats. And the shocker, a feline with stripes. That is definitely out of a fairy tale.) are so generic, it's hardly worth fretting over.
If she actually wanted to "rip off" your character, she did a really bad job of it.
but please, don't turn 2draw into a cat fight.
Khyle has those colors and markings for reasons. He's a combination of 2 (and only 2) specific 'demons' ... how we would view them as animals would simply be that he's one part Tiger (with horns), and he's one part Suricate/Meerkat. Since meerkats are most usually potrayed with darkened fingers, this is why he has the darkened fingers. He has the stripes, because he's part tiger, and he has horns because this perticular race of tiger-demons have horns. His color combination (of how I placed the colors down) is that of a suricate, specifically. The darkened fingers is what took the cake for me, and the addage of horns afterward just sealed the deal.
There /is/ a difference, yes. But they're only changes in accessorised features, such as eyes and hair and such...I'm talking about the overall, very basic character design here.
Sure she could say it's fan art and everything... and I mean, people only hafta /ask/ me if they wanna USE stuff... I HATE finding out that people've been using stuff /without/ permission, and they're sneaky about it. Nevertheless, I still don't like to see people using similar character designs to things. I really think it shows a flaw in the person's personal creativity, myself. She would only have to do a few very simple things to make this character her own, even with the colors that she's using. Just use them in a different way... like, move the stripes to the forehead... get rid of the brown markings on the fingers... or only mark the fingers halfway... or have it come right into the hand... just something to make it /her own/...
I don't want anything to happen to the peice... it's a very well drawn picture... I'm just concerned for my character design's well-being, that's all... as it's happened before...
Edit: I'm not trying to turn 2draw into a cat fight >>.<< It's just that I feel that the designs are much too similar, and much too suspicious for comfort. I have a right to be able to post my work and not come across something that was 'inspired' by my stuff, without anyone telling me about it. There's a lot of that sort of stuff going on, and it really discourages artists from wanting to post things, or to support anything on the internet that has to do with the arts.
Second off, you did not read what I wrote. The faces are completely different. And if you ask me, that is extremely significant in something that's remotely human. Look at the two characters side-by-side, toraneko's character's face is round and plump. Yours is very tall, thin, and lean. Toraneko's character's nose is almost flat against the face, yours is quite obviously sticking out considerably and is an important feature of your character, as far as expression. The eyebrows on your character are nearly on the eyes themselves, whereas the eyesbrows on toraneko's character are almost halfway between the hairline and her hairs. Your character has a much bigger and longer chin.
And that's just the face. The hair is completely different (and designing hair is not an easy task. That is to say, you cannot consider it as "changing an accessory"). The ears are slightly similar, but yours are quite distinctly pointed, while these are round (as far as the ear that is exposed is concerned). Toraneko's also has furry ears (as in hair coming out of ears and whatnot), while yours are fairly smooth.
Other things? The horns come out of a completely different place. and look nothing like the horns you drew. Toraneko's horns seem more like little devil horns while yours seem like ram's horns. Claws are considerably different, and the contrast on the fingers here is considerably different from yours. Sure, both characters have different colored fingers, but as I mentioned above, siamese cats have black paws... These in fact are much more similar to a siamese cat's than yours, as they are black, while yours are just a slightly darker brown than the rest of the hand.
Did I mention the fact that they are opposite sex!?
I shall rest my case now. I think you should be less uptight about your drawings unless the resemblance is undeniable. Too much stress will just come out in your drawings... the whole purpose for making art is so that other people can enjoy it. If you do not show anyone your work, what is the point?
I agree, it is annoying if someone outright copies and steals your ideas, but this is a little extreme. If you tried to sue for copyright infringement, you would most likely find yourself laughed out of the courtroom.
Now, as far as fanart is concerned, I do not see any reason one should have permission to draw fanart of your character or design, provided that they mention that it is fanart. You really cannot stop someone from liking your character design and trying to recreate it, provided that they say they are. It basically comes down to whether or not you are losing money due to an infringement.
If you can think it up on your own (which I have no proof of, but I'll accept it for now) Why can't she?
There is nothing new under the Sun, Alinnia.
I didn't get to read what you wrote, because I was /still/ writing mine after you posted. I'm not a mind reader. And I cannot see into the future.
Character design is a specific art, and it's one of my majors in my post-secondary education. I've taken many classes, many lessons, many crash-courses on the subject, and I /know/ what motivates people to put certain things into their designs. I /know/ what makes them similar. I /know/ what makes them different. I'm not stupid. I can see that it is female. I can see the difference in bone structure and what have you. But I'm not talking about sex or bone structure or the shape of their hair. I'm talking about the overall /design/. The DESIGN of the character. What kind of creature the OVERALL LOOK is potraying. That's what character DESIGN is. The DESIGN is much too suspiciously similar.
I don't have to post my work. I don't /have/ to share it with people. I can keep it to myself, and most of the time I prefer to. If anything, I create most, if not all, of my art to be enjoyed by myself. 2draw, DA, or any other of those artist sites are NOT a neccesity.
And it's hard not to get stressed about things when you know the person has seen your work... and they know what your work looks like. It's happened to me more than once where people've been 'inspired'... and most of the time I'm not even the one who finds these peices first.
And this issue isn't about money. It's about the love I have for my characters. They're my creations. My 'babies'. They have stories, lives, families, and histories. Seeing the look of your character being 'reproduced' in a random image breaks the heart, because of all the work that went into creating them.
Harmanye: Hey, I'm not saying she can't think up her own stuff. It's just that I know she's seen my work (as she's commented on it) and the designs are very similar. You /can/ think up new stuff. It just takes effort.
Maybe they are more similar than I think, but from the 4 pictures you linked, I will have to say the only real similarity is that they're both furries.
All I'm wanting to put forward through it is the fact that it is challenging to come up with something truely, truely original, but once you manage to do it, you're going to want to try and keep as much of it yours as you can. Like I said before, if she wanted to truely make it hers, to the point where it could be a /very/ original character, but still KEEP the stripes, and the markings, and the horns, she'd just hafta change a few things... But then she should keep an eye on other peoples' work to make /sure/ her designs are original, and are kept hers. It's simple, really. Challenging, but simple.
Nice drawing ToraNeko, I love the shines on the hair especially, and the water coming off the tongue. She be thirsty! lol. I hope you finish it despite everything. ^_^
*edit*I apologize, that was harsh, but all that bickering bugged meh.
Alright, so I'll say now, I want to thank everyone out there for defending me, and also, I can see exactly where Alinnia's perdicement is. Although I can see What you are complaining about, none of you pictures were in my mind, or intended when I did this. I was looking for new ears types that I don't usally do, as I had been playing around with cat and rabbit ears. I was driving, and pasted by the cow farm almost right across the street (Great cheese comes from happy cows, happy cows come from California) and was like "Ooo! Havn't ried that yet!" So playing around with them, I though they were more goat ears. Ta da, ears. And the earings are just there because they were kinda bland without. I had no plan of doing the coloring like yours, and if I did, I am truly sorry, quite frankly (maybe due to my memory flaws) all I can recall of yours was a white one. I used that particullar color because I usally use light skin tones, so I wanted it to be a skin tone, but not really, So the color I chose on was a slightly yellower color of my skin. And the white patch arounfd the mouth? I have a cat? What can I say? The hands I did that way becuse it was like hooves, but I didn't really want hooves, so I apted for that. Horns? Little cute ones, but again, playing on the cow/goat theme. The hair, That was hard, but entirly out of my hear with extreeme toying with. And yes, as Macello said, the original plan was a girl, its not my doing if some thought it was a boy. Oh and yes, the strips? If you read the posts at the top, Harmenye talked about strips. Thats the way I do all my strips. And besides, that has to be the most BASIC Way to draw them. How could THAT be infringing upon your rights? So again, I am greatly sorry for any trouble this caused, and I can see why there is such a fuss, but really, this is somewhat, dare I say, childish?
Edit: Umm, I don't go on Devin Art at all... It doesn't seem to like my connection, so I can't see most of the pictures, including the ones you sent links too. So how can I copy what I can't see? And further more, I find this quite offencive in a few of your remarks. For one, you say you arn't a mind reader, but the way you flash around all the courses you've taken, it seems very much so that you want to imply that you understand fully character buliding. That you can look at anything and quite simply figure out how and why it was created. So I suppose you no longer can have chance occurances, everything was already pre-planed, hm? And you also seem quite certain that I have no capabilities of thinking up my own work, that I just copy. What kinda---, pardon, is that? I should search the whole internet, and go around the world before drawing anything, just to make sure that no one has the same Idea. Come on, the whole world is built on modifying diffrent things, one thing leading to another. I'm sure that if you think about it, your very thoughts trail from one thing to another, till you are on an intierly diffrent plane then from what you thought before. You also stated yourself that your character is a hybrid of 2 difrent animals, but you didn't think them up, now did you? And its really really not to hard to draw something with horns and strips, I'm sure even you arn't the first one to think about it. So if you don't mind, I fond this whole thing quite bothersome, especially after looking back, I think I only commented on ONE of your pictures, that Tiger one.
drawn in 23 min
You really have to admit though, whipping out those links to devart as if they would prove your point would have been nice, except for fact that the designs, as you so put it, of the characters are completely different. I just don't get what you were alluding to at all, as imo they don't look remotely similar. And I'm not just talking about the details or whatever, I'm talking about what you were refering to with the whole "overall look"... no similarities whatsoever, sorry but I just don't see any. Is this over-reaction just a sympton of overly tight sphincter muscles?
I could just fall in love with this picture. Everything's there, all placed to it's right place making this a balanced masterpiece. The colours, lineart... heck, even the slight reflection on the water or how them fingers show through the water.
I like the original, felineish creature, as it reminds me of a fursona I created for my best friend. She, too, has horns and cat-like features and hooves. Even the hair-colour reminds of her. And am I bitching about copyrights? Hell no.~ Since it's said that a room with a hundred chimpanzees, given the time and typewriters, could type the whole Shakespeare productions, then why couldn't two people in this world come up with similar-looking characters? Not to say that they remind (as Marcello said) in any other real way that both are furries and have horns.
And if my comment starts the whole stupid, insensible whining all over again, I'm sorry in advance.
After a wonderfully busy weekend, and a successful college art sale... I have finally found the time to make my final comment on this peice. Sure, it's a nice peice. The drawing is nice. The coloring is nice. The idea is nice. But the character design is not original... it's as simple as that. It disappoints me to see such uncreative artists... and irrisponsible moderators. It's irritating to know that the 'attitudes' of the DeviantArt Admin have migrated on to other sites that /seem/ to have so much potential...
I really don't know if these 'programmers-turned-art-board-mods' understand what they've gotten themselves into. I know of many, hardworking, original character designers, many moving into the feild of animation, like myself, who constantly have their character designs copied and stolen, and the administration of the site do /nothing/ about it. (Some administration are MUCH better than others... Tiemann of the TLKFAA is rather strict about copyright laws... and he's well-respected for that.) If /I/ didn't think I was being ripped off, I wouldn't've said anything. Anything at all. ...
(And YES, ToraNeko, as a matter of fact, before most character designers come up with a new concept, we DO search the internet quite thuroughly to see what current designs are out there, and what is at the height of pop culture in the current time, to make /sure/ our concepts are different than those around us... it's all part of our responsibility as designers... If you can't take on that responsibility... DON'T DO IT.)
And of COURSE the world is built on modifying different things. My character in and of himself must be made of at least 12 different concepts from existing characters from popular series'... but you'd never know. It IS a hybrid of 2 different animals.. animals aren't copyrighted.. however, within the thousands of combinations one /could/ have made with these animals, why should 2 designs look /that/ simliar at all? And when I say look at the image, I mean put both of them side-by-side and compare. NOT look at /one/ picture for two seconds, and then ('try to') look at the other for two seconds.. of course you're going to conclude and assume without looking.
It's sad that artists can't use the internet as a tool for their work, and not be safe. And when I say artists, I don't mean the fanboys, fangirls, and wannabes that frequent these sites. I mean the artists who know what they're doing. The serious ones who plan on doing this as a career for the rest of their lives. Not some little hobby that they do once in awhile. It's sad that those serious about their practition have to be cautious about what they do, and what they post, in fear of the concept of those who can't seem to reach beyond what they see right in front of them.
Personally, I don't think these sites should be supported anymore. No 2draw. No DeviantArt. No Elfwood. No VCL. No mass-oriented art sites at all in existance. There are too many fan-wannabes that look through them... wannabes that just don't appreciate originality for what it is. Private galleries are the way to go, and I can assure you that artists DO NOT need any of these silly sites to get exposure, or to share their art with other people. Sure, I thought it was fun in the beginning... but now it's just out of hand. Moderators are irrisponsible... most 'members' and 'critics' even moreso... equality is null.
These sites no longer have my support. No funding. No art. No reccomendations. Only warnings to those who may wish to join. Don't post your ideas on these sites.. fan-wannabes /will/ steal them..
And those who haven't had their ideas ripped-off yet? ... Watch. It'll happen. Then you'll know how /I/ feel.
Find me some people who actually agree with you, because there sure are a lot of people who do not. Copyright law is not being broken here, so do not make it sound like someone is doing you a great injustice.
edit: at the expense of my linear algebra homework, I am gonna actually try replying to your message. Although I find it hard to stop laughing.
Despite what you might think, the moderators for a site are to help me, not you. No where do we claim to be artistic moderators or professionals in the field of critiquing or judging your pictures. We are not paid enough for that.
Sorry to take you away from your busy schedule. But aside from your effort to make yourself sound superior again, you really need to learn how to spell. A college student has no excuse for misspelling 8 words in something that short, especially with words such as "piece," "irresponsible," "field," "thoroughly," and so on. And none are typos.
First off, as we do not know of every character or drawing submitted on the internet, we really cannot do anything about pieces that no one says anything about. In this case, there is no relation at all between the characters to give you any case.
Then e-mail him and send him this link, and have him CC me a reply, I want to hear his opinion.
Care to share how one goes about doing this? How would someone find your design, for example, and know to avoid copying it? Search for "original furries with horns" on google?
Again, you continue to insult my intelligence. And though undeserving, I spent quite a bit of time looking over both of them, side-by-side to see if I could see what you meant. Alas I found quite the opposite, as I detailed in my previous messages.
Quite sad. Definitely not safe, in fact, you might even get a virus! *shocker* I want to find someone serious about their "practition." (P.s. I am mocking you here, because your b.s.ing is amusing.)
Do not support them, then. No one is forcing you.
You realize you sound like a snob when you say that, right?
This is your problem, you are so caught up in the politics of it that you cannot do it for fun. 2draw is not a place to post your resume, it is to have fun drawing in one's spare time.
Wow, if something this "similar" is the worst that will happen when someone rips me off, I guess I should not be too worried about anything!
I shudder at the thought.
And in conclusion, your design is not that great. I mean, come on, it is a furry.
Marcello... most people against furry art don't find originality in their peices... I've seen a few rants and such where furry artists feel 'unloved' as opposed to a person who copies 'anime' art
o.o *shrugs* But that's just me.. find one of those people supporting her? Well I'd be one :3
Watch as I end up on some.. hit list now or something x.x;;
.... and yis, Mr. Tiemann is very strict about such things... I doubt Alinnia will be stopping here anymore so I'll deliver him this postage and stuff, alrighties? :3
Sometimes I just wish some peeps would see eye to eye instead of thinking their views are always correct...
Although posting to the pic...
only thing I see wrong with it is the tongue... x.x Too red for my tastes.. other than that, it's a fine peice. If it was copy designed or not, I like it :3