Human beauty and other proportional systems...
http://goldennumber.net/beauty.htm

I always find it interesting how mathematical everything seems to be, yet so many artists "hate math". I don't know if I agree or think that things are really broken down to just numbers, but I do think that things can be broken down into smaller units, if we see fit. Anyway I don't have alot to say, just thought it was interesting, and wanted to see other's thoughts on it.
What do you think defines beauty?

Take care.

Interesting stuff

Very interesting. Ill have to finish reading all the that sometime. I think that that would be interesting to understand, and make you think of things in a difference perspective. I dunno. That's what I think.

Beauty to me is what I say it is. If I look at it and think it's beautiful than it is. If it's not beautiful I hate it.

All their noses looked.. nearly exactly the same.. at least to me.. o.o;

All I can think of is from that old Proverb: "Beauty is in the eye of a beholder." But I also like this one: "Beauty is only skin-deep."

Cordelia.. don't forget this one.. "Pretty is as Pretty does." Interesting reading there, LisaAnne.

The website shows some faces and claims that they are beautiful because of their connection to the phi ratio, but it does not show faces unrelated to the phi ratio. If such a face is shown and people still find beauty on it, then the theory will be disproved.
Not to say that the phi phenomenon is not of great interest, or that the perception of beauty is not in some way hereditary.
But I do not think there is any proof of why phi is responsible for people thinking of beauty the way they do (which by the way is very diverse). >:)
|XOD|

According to this theory, this guy is almost a knockout:

http://www.angelfire.com/rings/cloxboy/hitler.gif

Perhaps it's a bunch of bullshit? I'm guessing it is.

Beauty isn't all concrete.

Um.. that's interesting cloxboy. Um.. i think that it might not apply to everything, i mean they can change the angles slightly, and make lines longer and such to meet the persons face, making look like it fits the phi thing. I dunno, I could be wrong.

Haha...yeah. On one of the counter pages they talked about how to get the most accurate photo/mask, as well as variations. The system probably works, its just I think that what one finds "most" beautiful could vary. I don't really necessarily agree...just think its interesting.

I think its mathmatical. ^_^...and as for hitler, he would be, if his lips were full like the mask shows. he isnt ugly looking because hes Hitler. His face doesnt fit the mask exactly..but if it did he would be pretty...and he does come close.

I found a nice website: http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/pseudo/fibonacc.htm
Cloxboy, that picture you made is awesome! It fits Mr. Hitler almost perfectly! <:D
Oh and do you know of a movie called Pi? That was a crazy movie, haha! >:)
|XOD|

i dont think that beauty can be fully measured with mathematics...what is beautiful to one person might not be beautiful to another person...i do think that it can be measured mathematically to some extexnt though...people tend to think someone is ugly if their face is too deformed and out of proportion...

Actually, if Hitler's head was looking straight ahead, it would almost be a perfect match, unfortunately his head is at a slight 3/4 view. As well, I imagine I could find 100's of other samples to disprove this idiotic theory, using even uglier people than Hitler. A proportional face is nice, but not always beautiful. There is no mold for beauty, this is all a bunch of crap.

beauty is what makes you fall to your knees and cry out baecause you can't hold the wonder inside you. Beautiful is my alltime favorite word.

I also saw the http://www.beautyanalysis.com website.
I could not understand how all the different faces they claim to be beautiful really match their mask. They are simply different.
And as examples of unattractive faces they have people with hypertelorism... which is kind of extreme. >:)
|XOD|

I wonder why the word beauty is so harshly and wrongly used. These days the definition of beauty is perfection, no? Being beautiful automatically means you're flawless or perfect. Is that what the word beauty was even created for? No. Beauty isn't meant to stand for perfection or flawlessness. It's meant to stand for something beyond that. It's not perfection, that's for sure. It's more of a word to descibe looks. Can that truely what beauty was supposed to associate with?

Beauty -
# The quality that gives pleasure to the mind or senses and is associated with such properties as harmony of form or color, excellence of artistry, truthfulness, and originality.
# One that is beautiful, especially a beautiful woman.
# A quality or feature that is most effective, gratifying, or telling: The beauty of the venture is that we stand to lose nothing.
# An outstanding or conspicuous example: “Hammett's gun went off. The shot was a beauty, just slightly behind the eyes” (Lillian Hellman).

That's the definition as it is in the dictionary. The most it can say about beauty doesn't have to do with looks.

My definition is pretty simple. Take a ugly flower and you can see the beauty of it. It's more of what's on the inside than anything. To take a picture of something captures it's natural beauty, which is to capture it's true form.

Yes! Math shouldn't have to tell us what beauty is! RAWR!

Yeah power to you squee! I wanna go back in time and kill the person who invented math! RAWR!!!
(psst, squee, do you play MTG?)

if you ask me... beuty is overated... look for the bizarre :d

I can't really see how any of that nonsense has anything to do with either mathematics or beauty.

Exactly. Math has nothing to do with beauty!! lol

Simply not true.

http://www.fractalartcontests.com/2000/en/entry-004-7.htm
http://www.fractalus.com/info/layman.htm
http://fred.mitchellware.com/fractals/
http://www.faemalia.net/Fractals/
http://www.wackerart.de/fractal.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractals

Oookay...Math shouldn't define idealistic beauty. That's just plain wrong. >_>

I think there is great beauty in math, but the phi theory of the ideal face does not sound logical.
If there is a certain face that people are programmed to like, then how do people like catgirls? >;)
|XOD|

haha.. nice Xod. Catgirls faces are generally more wide than longated. And many people think they are sexy. So yeah, you give a good example xod. Lol.

i think they are sexy, cause they be soft, cuddly, and have them ever so useful tails... mmm fuzzy

1.618 is so sexy. But don't tell him I said so!

Wow if only Einstein were still around...

What would Einstein have to do with this?

numbers
duh

I like John Conway's Game of Life alot. <:)
|XOD|

so who dosen't

Ooh. I love that game. I always end up with like.. only 2 kids.

What kids???
Why would they put kids in a shooting game??

What? o___o Crud I was thinking of another game. There's a board game called THe Game of Life. Mix up. >__<

It is neither Hasbro's Game of life (although I used to play it when I was little), nor any shooting game, but a mathematical game. It might be confusing to explain it since I did not understand it well myself before I downloaded a program to display it. By the way, it is not really a game, it has no purpose other than a mathematical display, like a program that draws fractal shapes for instance. >:)
http://www.ibiblio.org/lifepatterns/
|XOD|

Oooh.. Hm... that's interesting, and ... uhm.. weird. :D its fun to mess around with.

I've never seen this beauty mask thing before but I'm aware of the Golden Ratio. It was known by the Egyptians and Greeks and can be seen in their architecture.
I don't know why so many artists hate math. Many mathematicians see math as an art in itself. Also, M.C. Escher's art drew a lot of admiration from mathematicians, and that's because Escher incorporated many mathematical principles in his artwork. Math, art, and beauty can go hand in hand!

Hearing the word beauty reminds me of a quote I read once, along the lines of
``Beauty is truth, and imagination is stronger than fact.``

o.O; I believe I read it in a comment, on a Science Fiction and Fantasy Art site, though..